Unnamed(?) logical fallacies

Started by MrBogosity, September 24, 2009, 04:12:10 PM

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Quote from: BogosityForumUser on June 09, 2014, 10:26:12 PM
Just download a copy of dosbox (either from dosbox.com or your package manager) and a copy from your most trusted abandonware site.  Sadly, Muse went out of business and there is mixed information as to what happened at the asset auction.  Therefore, who owns the rights is somewhat questionable, which makes the legality of acquiring a copy even more dubious.  Yet another reason to support shorter copyright terms in our modern technological age.

As for text adventures, there are many of them online now (for FREE!) and many more still get made.  Sadly, more than a few have been lost and will remain so someone gets their dusty 5" out.

There was a DOS version? I only played it on the Apple ][.

Even if we don't limit the age of copyright, there still should be an exception made for abandonware.

Quote from: BogosityForumUser on June 09, 2014, 10:26:12 PM
Just download a copy of dosbox (either from dosbox.com or your package manager) and a copy from your most trusted abandonware site.  Sadly, Muse went out of business and there is mixed information as to what happened at the asset auction.  Therefore, who owns the rights is somewhat questionable, which makes the legality of acquiring a copy even more dubious.  Yet another reason to support shorter copyright terms in our modern technological age.

As for text adventures, there are many of them online now (for FREE!) and many more still get made.  Sadly, more than a few have been lost and will remain so someone gets their dusty 5" out.

yeah, ran into that problem myself. was able to get a hold of an abandonware that I was looking for, and mentioned it online at a website. Not knowing the legal status (since it included mentioning how I go it), I was flagged for breach of copyright (understandable for a forum that makes little in the way of profits, and has to put up with SEGA all day). When I appealed to them explaining this was abandonware, we both discovered the real problem (what you just said namely).

eventually (to their credit), the admins decided to let this pass--though it left all leery of future sharing of abandonware. No one wants to get into trouble with GovCo
"All you guys complaining about the possibility of guy on guy relationships...you're also denying us girl on girl.  Works both ways if you know what I mean"

-Jesse Cox

Is there a name for when a statist says libertarianism is feudalism?
"The more laws and order are made prominent, the more thieves and robbers there will be."
Lao Tzu

Quote from: R.E.H.W.R. on June 25, 2014, 11:14:01 PM
Is there a name for when a statist says libertarianism is feudalism?

Completely fucking retarded ignorant?
Avatar image by Darkworkrabbit on deviantart

Quote from: AnCapBrony on June 25, 2014, 11:33:28 PM
Completely fucking retarded ignorant?
But serfdom is voluntary.
"The more laws and order are made prominent, the more thieves and robbers there will be."
Lao Tzu

Quote from: R.E.H.W.R. on June 26, 2014, 12:47:33 AM
But serfdom is voluntary.

Yea, just like the "social contract." Because you can leave any time you want, don't ya know?

Quote from: R.E.H.W.R. on June 25, 2014, 11:14:01 PM
Is there a name for when a statist says libertarianism is feudalism?

I think it's pretty close to Shane's argumentum ad servitus, aka "appeal to slavery."
Failing to clean up my own mistakes since the early 80s.

Quote from: Altimadark on June 26, 2014, 11:54:44 AM
Yea, just like the "social contract." Because you can leave any time you want, don't ya know?

Which was the point of my video: if the statist policy is legitimate because people can leave, despite customs, passport restrictions, expat taxes, etc., then libertarianism must be MORE legitimate because we wouldn't impose ANY of these things!

And not only did he NOT respond to this point, he claims that I didn't MAKE any points, and instead was just "whining about customs and taxes."

Watching Stef's latest video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeqaRyrdcCY) I kept thinking about this "don't label me" crap, which has ALWAYS bugged me.

Labels exist for a reason. We communicate using language, and every noun and adjective is a label on a person, place, thing, idea, or construct. The "don't label me!" gambit seems to be a way of avoiding the consequences of one's own actions or positions. Like when we point out that someone's idea of eliminating personal property is socialist, and they go, "Don't label me!" As if the mere act of using an adjective somehow invalidates our criticisms of his position, almost like he's accusing us of a strawman fallacy.

Here's the thing: a label either fits or it doesn't. If we use a label and it doesn't fit you, EXPLAIN WHY! Don't use its mere status as a label as a way of dismissing our response. If you can't, if you resort to "Don't label me, bro!" then we'll assume the label fits and you're being defensive because you don't want to face the consequences of your actions or position.

What do you think? What should we call this one?

Quote from: MrBogosity on July 10, 2014, 09:26:44 AM
Watching Stef's latest video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeqaRyrdcCY) I kept thinking about this "don't label me" crap, which has ALWAYS bugged me.

Labels exist for a reason. We communicate using language, and every noun and adjective is a label on a person, place, thing, idea, or construct. The "don't label me!" gambit seems to be a way of avoiding the consequences of one's own actions or positions. Like when we point out that someone's idea of eliminating personal property is socialist, and they go, "Don't label me!" As if the mere act of using an adjective somehow invalidates our criticisms of his position, almost like he's accusing us of a strawman fallacy.

Here's the thing: a label either fits or it doesn't. If we use a label and it doesn't fit you, EXPLAIN WHY! Don't use its mere status as a label as a way of dismissing our response. If you can't, if you resort to "Don't label me, bro!" then we'll assume the label fits and you're being defensive because you don't want to face the consequences of your actions or position.

What do you think? What should we call this one?
Or the people who say they don't like labels because "it divides us!"

As for a name....um... I feel like it should be a pop culture reference (like the Pulling a Lindy one) but I can't think of any good ones.
"When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world—'No. You move.'"
-Captain America, Amazing Spider-Man 537

Quote from: Travis Retriever on July 10, 2014, 02:42:12 PM
Or the people who say they don't like labels because "it divides us!"

As for a name....um... I feel like it should be a pop culture reference (like the Pulling a Lindy one) but I can't think of any good ones.

The "Not a Spade Fallacy?"

Quote from: dallen68 on July 14, 2014, 06:03:36 AM
The "Not a Spade Fallacy?"
I like it! :)
"When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world—'No. You move.'"
-Captain America, Amazing Spider-Man 537


This one needs to be here.  Inspired by the thread on Climate Change with me and Jason Fennec here:  https://plus.google.com/107601466108345042986/posts/bNAavAzHBBF

Argument from uncertainty.  Something shouldn't be tried/is a bad idea because some unspecified, bad thing might happen at some point in the future that me or no one else knows about yet.

In his case, saying we can't do the marine cloud whitening program because it would effect the entire world with bad stuff that he doesn't even know will happen yet.
Similar to statists who cry that "but we don't know what will happen if we repeal that policy!" or whatever.
"When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world—'No. You move.'"
-Captain America, Amazing Spider-Man 537

Quote from: Travis Retriever on July 20, 2014, 10:12:48 PM
Argument from uncertainty.  Something shouldn't be tried/is a bad idea because some unspecified, bad thing might happen at some point in the future that me or no one else knows about yet.

Actually, that's Argument from Adverse Consequences.

Quote from: MrBogosity on July 21, 2014, 07:39:36 AM
Actually, that's Argument from Adverse Consequences.
Oh yeah. I almost forgot.
"When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world—'No. You move.'"
-Captain America, Amazing Spider-Man 537