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Podcast for 5-23-2011

Started by MrBogosity, May 22, 2011, 04:37:35 PM

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May 22, 2011, 04:37:35 PM
Play the Podcast

News of the Bogus:


Biggest Bogon Emitter: The TSA http://blog.tsa.gov/2011/05/texas-house-of-representatives-seeking.html

Idiot Extraordinaire: President Barack Obama http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/05/17/statement-press-secretary-s-940

This Week's Quote: "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future." —Niels Bohr
May 22, 2011, 06:01:56 PM #1
From what I heard, Camping apparently fled and hasn't been heard from since. The sad part about this is the victims of extreme faith, the people who sold all their possessions and blew all their money thinking it was the end of the world. Now they're royally screwed, which may lead to possible suicides or even murders from people who are so broken from this that they become violent, because they lost everything.
May 22, 2011, 06:30:24 PM #2
are you gonna try and tell us exxon mobiles 10.7 billion profits for just this quarter comes from a mere few cents on the dollar profit margin?
May 22, 2011, 06:33:36 PM #3
Quote from: D.Turcotte on May 22, 2011, 06:01:56 PM
From what I heard, Camping apparently fled and hasn't been heard from since. The sad part about this is the victims of extreme faith, the people who sold all their possessions and blew all their money thinking it was the end of the world. Now they're royally screwed, which may lead to possible suicides or even murders from people who are so broken from this that they become violent, because they lost everything.

Apparently: http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/articles/149749/20110521/failed-may-21-2011-doomsday-prophet-harold-camping-still-missing-followers-devastated-photos.htm

I also can't connect to familyradio.com. Apparently they closed up shop and left.
May 22, 2011, 06:35:17 PM #4
Quote from: kitrana on May 22, 2011, 06:30:24 PM
are you gonna try and tell us exxon mobiles 10.7 billion profits for just this quarter comes from a mere few cents on the dollar profit margin?

That's ALL of Exxon's profits; I was talking about merely the profits from their gasoline sales (they do a lot more, you know). Also, [citation needed].
May 22, 2011, 07:16:59 PM #5 Last Edit: May 22, 2011, 09:39:53 PM by D.Turcotte
I also thought that article on insider trading was a rather interesting read. I always questioned the idea of why it was illegal, but I never had a full structured argument other than, "We use insider information all the time, what's the difference here?"

I've always disliked the notion of disliking people who have more money, simply because they have more money. It seems like people are simply looking for ways to make it a crime for someone else to have more money than themselves. I posted that piece on facebook questioning whether or not insider trading should be illegal, and I got this response:

QuoteAs much as it's not hurting anybody and it's none of the government's business, it's not like people affected by this law can't afford to pay the fine and move on. I don't really have any sympathy for people who make a hundred times what the average person does in a year and bitch about not being able to make more. In fact, it makes me kinda mad that such greed is being vouched for at all.

So let me get this straight. Having the option to not lose money is a sign of greed? My head nearly exploded reading that.


EDIT:
So I responded to this person with the following:
QuoteWell the argument here is, most of the time, it's not that they're necessarily making money as much as it is that they're simply not losing money. Also, for whatever reason, the law doesn't seem to go after people who end up losing money ei...ther, because let's face it, while there may be inside information, it isn't always accurate. Also, it should be noted that when someone uses insider information for any other circumstance, money making or not, it's considered perfectly okay, but in the stock market it's considered heinous. I don't necessarily agree with that position.

This was the response I got:
QuoteCan you give me a few examples of exploitation of insider information in circumstances that don't involve personal gain? I can't really see any other use for it. And it's not like secret advantages are only looked down upon in the stockmark...et - I mean, blackmail is illegal and transparency is expected (though seldom upheld) of government dealings as well.

As far as the law is concerned, if the fact that members of Parliament and Congress can get away with buying hookers and blow on their federal expense accounts doesn't say that it only applies when the government wants it to apply, I don't know what does. However, in Wall Street's case, I think people who spend their lives hoarding away more money than they could ever even spend in their lifetime while people in their own city are starving and penniless on the streets don't have any right to complain about injustice.

My retort:
QuoteSince when is personal gain such a terrible thing? When you find out about a good deal in your local grocery store, you're aiming for personal gain. When you hear about discounts or sales of products you want, you're thinking in terms of personal gain. Or are you insinuating that if you have more money, you are inherently a less moral person for it? Everything that we do is for personal gain. There's nothing wrong with it as long as there are no victims, and in the case of basic insider information, meaning that you have used knowledge that insiders have given you for the means of not losing money, it is a victimless crime. What I find repugnant is people who think that if someone has money and makes more money, or in this case sustains money, they are automatically bad and need to be stopped. All these people talk about how greedy they are, but why don't they put their money where their mouth is and put up their own cash? I can understand if you were talking about people who go out of their way to screw everyone over left and right, but more times than not, people are not being specific and mean ANYONE who has more money than them. If someone knows something, and uses it, it's called being smart under any other context. Why is it suddenly bad when money is involved, especially when there are no victims. I question it from a law standpoint, and nothing more. Whether you find it immoral is your own deal, but from a legal standpoint, I see nothing wrong with it if there is no one being screwed over out of it.
May 25, 2011, 08:30:54 PM #6
That whole business with the Indiana supreme court, Stef basically explained that as "The state has run out of money to bribe people into obedience so now you'll be seeing it rely more and more on crude violence instead."  IN other words, this case sadly won't be the last.
I recently heard that the word heretic is derived from the greek work heriticos which means "able to choose"
The more you know...
May 25, 2011, 08:31:21 PM #7
It's not, as the next podcast will show...
May 29, 2011, 09:16:40 PM #8
OK, I'm finally listening to this one.
To add to your thoughts on Insider Trading, I still remember when my mom was bashing Martha Stewart during her Insider Trading fiasco.  My mom's justification as to why it's wrong is because she had information that others didn't have access to.  But even then, LONG before even becoming a libertarian--much less an anarchist or even a skeptic--I smelled bullshit.  I mean, think about it!  If that was really taken to its logical extreme, we'd have to punish or even jail people who had the money to take SAT prep courses.  After all, THEY had information that no one else had access to, especially *gasp* the poor!
"When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world—'No. You move.'"
-Captain America, Amazing Spider-Man 537
May 29, 2011, 09:22:52 PM #9 Last Edit: May 30, 2011, 02:28:07 AM by surhotchaperchlorome
Wow...those Indiana cases actually made me a bit angry...
In fact, those and the bit about the TSA reminded me of something my (former) economics professor I'll be posting in the relevant thread.
"When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world—'No. You move.'"
-Captain America, Amazing Spider-Man 537
June 08, 2011, 10:12:25 PM #10
As long as you mention Martha Stewart I think it should be pointed out that she was not convicted for 'Insider Trading'.  She was convicted on four counts of 'Obstructing Justice'. 

So what this means is that if they hadn't come after her for some sort of law breaking then she would not have broken any laws since she was only convicted of lying to the investigators.

So they started their witch hunt and created the situation in which the law was broken thus they caught their witch.
June 08, 2011, 10:15:58 PM #11
Quote from: Bignuncio on June 08, 2011, 10:12:25 PM
As long as you mention Martha Stewart I think it should be pointed out that she was not convicted for 'Insider Trading'.  She was convicted on four counts of 'Obstructing Justice'.

She was actually convicted for lying to Federal investigators. She claimed her sale of ImClone stock was due to a stop-loss at 60. Her broker confirmed it...UNTIL they arrested him and threatened to prosecute him unless he changed his story. (How that isn't suborning perjury I still haven't figured out.) So he took the stand and gave their spoon-fed testimony.

The prosecutor convinced the jury that he was telling the truth and Stewart lying because, how come she just HAPPENED to sell at a time when the price was dropping? Never mind the fact that this is how a stop-loss works!

QuoteSo what this means is that if they hadn't come after her for some sort of law breaking then she would not have broken any laws since she was only convicted of lying to the investigators.

I know. It's kind of like being arrested for resisting arrest, without being arrested for anything to begin with that you could have resisted.
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